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Wheely, DRiVR, Uber or Addison Lee?

Cab4Now.com Addison Lee, Blog+, Uber Wheely, DRiVR, Uber or Addison Lee?

Addison Lee Blog+ Uber

Wheely, DRiVR, Uber or Addison Lee?

Posted By Cab4Now

Written by Cab4Now

124 thoughts on “Wheely, DRiVR, Uber or Addison Lee?

  1. I am a little confused by your article above, very insightful but its written in favour, or should I say more balanced to addison lee, whom I love and used. Your mentioned for uber, wheely drivr, they charged 24%. But your article was giving the impression that it was high and that was not the case at addison lee, as in your own words and your 40 hour work book, you gave the impression that all that money was given directly to the driver along with his cash work. You also suggest that if you did a little mile extra like most of the good addison drivers do, you end up paying nothing for rent.

    So this leads me to ask as an accountant, if that is the case, driver is paid all his account work, the mileage paid is lower on addison lee as opposed to the others, you don’t pay no rent you you go above and beyond, where in that formula and business model does it show addison lee makes any money. Where is the revenue stream that allows addison to make millions per year. So it leads me to believe that on account work, addison lee is charging their clients more money than they are showing to the drivers.

    Await your response.

    1. Hello, I am going to explain how companies that have accounts like addison Lee make their money from the cab circuit.
      If a driver takes a passenger from HAP T5 to Basingstoke for example, the fare is approx £50. If Addison Lees percentage is 20%, this will leave the driver with £40.
      Addison Lee will charge the account customer about twice the fare (£100). £50 is our fare, £50 is the cost of administering the account.
      So whatever fares the driver takes, the cab company makes approx the same plus 20% of the drivers fare.
      They also make money on the rental of the cars to the drivers.
      If the average driver takes an average of £600 per week in fares, then
      if Addison Lee has 4000 drivers (£600 x 4000 = £2,400,000 per week plus vehicle rental.

  2. Hi, thanks for your comment.

    Apologies for the confusion.

    When you compare Wheely, DRiVR and Uber commission rates of 24% to the commission of 12% charged by Hailo and the flat rate charged by GetTaxi I feel I can state my position very clearly. Wheely, DRiVR and Uber commission rates are too high for London minicab drivers. Hailo and GetTaxi would not be around if they had started with those rates.

    I intentionally gave the”…impression that all that money was given directly to the driver along with his cash work” because that is correct. It is a copy of my Addison Lee invoice.

    The fares you refer to are what were paid to me based loosely around the Addison Lee mileage rate of £1.60 per mile. That is the rate which Addison Lee pay me. Obviously, Addison Lee charges a different higher rate to the client. But for the purpose of this article I am comparing what a London minicab driver would earn.

    As the worst example let’s consider DRiVR. Why anybody would consider being paid a net mileage rate after commission of £1.16 per mile – yes, that is correct, £1.16 per mile – is beyond me. Then DRiVR want you to have a late model Toyota Prius or better which you buy and maintain.

    I think I’ll stay with my 1.60 per mile on cards or account and £2.90 per mile cash. Cash fares at Addison Lee attract a flat charge debited from account earnings of £1.00 5am to 5pm and £2.00 5pm to 5am regardless of the fare value. Finally, the slam dunk for Addison Lee is that most weeks I pay no rent for the car.

  3. Ok, I’ve just done a few quotes from Hoxton to Liverpool street station, 1.5 miles away and here are the quotes. Addlee 15.60 card, wheely 9, uber 14-16. So base on your table which should addlee to be the cheapest, it doesn’t stand to reason. Take it you are on a points system with addlee, where you pay a fixed amount to them for cash jobs, and you are paid 1.60 per mile for card and account and the rest addlee keep. So for instance my quote of 15.60 from Hoxton of 1.5miles, you would be paid 6.50 minimum + 1.6 x 1.5 = £8.90 to the driver.

    So addlee pockets 15.60 – 8.90 = 6.70, with £2 for credit card processing, leaves 4.70, that well above 24%.

    So how is addlee different, they don’t make millions for the kindness of his heart.

    1. I believe your Uber quote is based on UberLux and not UberX. UberX requires London private hire drivers to join with an E class Mercedes or similar rather than an S class Mercedes or similar. The rates I have used in the table above are based on UberX.

      I believe you’re trying to make the point that Addison Lee commission rates are considerably higher than 24% for account and card fares? My position is that what matters is the amount that a London minicab driver ends up with and that is the focus of this article.

      Fortunately, as London’s favourite minicab company, Addison Lee is able to charge significantly higher fares which makes Addison Lee minicab drivers the best paid in the industry.

      The thrust of this article focuses on the ridiculously low rates offered to London minicab drivers by Uber and DRiVR. I believe they will both have to revise their fares to attract sufficient numbers of London minicab drivers to provide the coverage their clients will expect.

      Finally, whilst I appreciate your comments, it is not my place to discuss the charging structure between Addison Lee and their clients. I am only concerned with the bottom line for me – the amount I receive as a self employed London minicab driver. The choice is clear for me. I am where I am because it’s still the best deal for a London minicab driver. Quite frankly, with so many apps available now that is surprising. But we are where we are and everyone will need to change as the London private hire operator model is disrupted further.

    2. You can see why Hailo is doing so well, Hoxton to Liverpool street stn, using the best cabs in the world, keeping away from traffic or other drivers using there Sat Navs and all for around half the price, around £6.00.

  4. Don’t get me wrong, your website is great and very informative, that why I am here. But when we do comment on other companies or trying to she’d light it’s best to remain balanced at all times. Because on first reading one gets the impression that all but addlee charges a high premium than that of addlee. It’s not just about a good deal for drivers, but also for customers also.

    1. Thanks for the compliment on the website.

      I agree it is important to have balance when giving an opinion. My views on this topic, however, may have reflected my disappointment that at a time of burgeoning choice for customers the new apps such as Uber and DRiVR are offering mileage rates which are not sustainable for London minicab owner drivers.

      I totally agree that the customer is king. This is true more today than ever before. However, mileage rates offered need to be equitable for both the client and the London minicab owner driver on the back of whom the new app companies are looking to build their businesses.

      I believe in the free market and if Uber and DRiVR can build their businesses at the rates offered then I will be proved wrong and Wheely will have to reduce their rates to compete. I just don’t see how there will be enough self employed London minicab owner drivers willing to sub contract at the rates offered by either Uber or DRiVR. It’s early days and I will watch and comment further as the minicab booking app market develops and matures.

  5. Incredible. I don’t think for one moment that DRiVR  doubled their mileage rate because of Cab4Now.com. Just a few days after this article was published but who knows? Who cares? They’ve done the right thing and are aiming to compete with Wheely rather than Uber. The race to the bottom may be stalling. 🙂

    I sent a tweet to invite @Drivr_UK to comment here or on Twitter. I hope they join the conversation but I won’t hold my breath.

    It only now remains for Uber to increase their mileage rates on UberX. DRiVR TweetHowever, because their rates are based on time and mileage they do not need to carry out such a drastic revision as DRiVR. The difficulty for Uber is that they’ve got the UberLux pricing to consider for any UberX revision. Tricky.

    What should the difference be for an S class Mercedes or similar on UberLux and an E class Mercedes or similar on UberX?

  6. @Cab4Now
    An insider’s opinion is always appreciated! What you originally reported on were our beta rates. We provided discounted rides for the end user during our testing period, but took care of the drivers as well during that time. The rates you see now are our normal rates that reflect our stance on keeping not only the client happy, but the driver as well. 🙂

    1. Hi Drivr UK,

      Thanks for the update. Good luck. Looking forward to the Android app launch. If you launch an affiliate scheme similar to Uber’s or better I’ll set up a link here at Cab4Now.com.

      Uber has done well from new active clients generated from their link above.


    Yellow Cars – Islington – Charge you £140 for old banger Prius + £60 to £80+ Insurance + £140 Office Rent + Commission on every job from 50p to £2.50. This You will be lucky if you can take home £350 pw after 72+hrs of work. (When you leave them they may want to steal your £400 deposit you paid them!!) they will probably say you got tickets on their car etc.

    GLH 75% Account + Cash VERY LOW RATE.
    (The Accounts they have are mostly Small Business and The Biggest is Channel 4)

    All day long (£8.90 Up to 8miles) and the dead miles will cost you a lot they will drive you all over London. if you do 12hrs shift x 6 days you will be lucky to take £250 to £400 home after all expense. The Car + Insurance + XDA cost £160 pw if you do 36 accounts job if not well you F****. Imagine from W1 to E14 or E16 you get £8.90 that’s 8miles on Account!!! This is probably one of the cheapest minicab and so called Executive Circuit (Lots of disabled people and Hospital pick ups) loading cars with heavy wheelchairs. DON’T JOIN INSTEAD GO JSA your better off!! Min fare £6.50 Cash 3 miles and £7.50 for 4miles + on Account.
    Cash Job: N2 TO LHR £34 – 20% – 4.5% VAT = £25.67 that’s 21miles + and on Acc you will get £23. the fare they charge is same as AdLee but they rob the drivers on account. DON’T FALL FOR THE FAKE ON GUMTREE THEY HAVE NO NEW ACC. You will wait 1 to 3hrs for a job.

    Excel 100% Account Work – when times are bad you will suffer!!! £350 to £500 pw after all cost. They Charge £180 for Prius + Insurance and £7 for XDA per week. Min Fare £8 for the first 3miles for company drivers and £10 for owner drivers for the first 4 to 5 miles. A very uniqe system is they will allow you to take a job for your next shift so that you don’t wait when you log on however this is not always possible.

    Brunel (BRU CAR) 100% Account Work – Have the best Accounts in London (well not better then Ad Lee) (Few FTSE 100 Companies) but you will wait 2 to 4hrs for work. Rates are same as Excel minimum fare driver gets is £8 for the first 3miles. Prius cost £150 pw Merc E Class Cost £270. Driver must do 5x12hr Shift. If you take the Merc you will probably just work 2 – 3 days to pay for the Car. Again £350 to £500 if you’re lucky after cost. You will wait 2 to 4hrs for your first job.

    Creative Cars 100% Account – All small media based company based in W1. Most staff are very friendly so its nice to work with such people however the earning is minimal. Company Prius cost £230pw inc Insurance + £10pw XDA + £15pw Car Wash after expense you will earn £300 to £500 for 12hr x 6days. They have put in a new rule where if you don’t do a minimum of 60hrs they will charge you £70 (a so called circuit fee). You will wait 1 to 3 hrs for a job.

    Cyclone Cars 100% Account – All small media based company W1. expect to make £300 to £450pw for 6 x12hr shift pw.

    Airport Direct – Do Not Waste Time joining you will lose money.
    Owner Drivers – or Rent your Car your doomed.
    Charge £162 for Circuit Rent + commission per every job. Commission ranges from 50p to £5. So if you made gross £800 – £162 – 15% ish Commission – Fuel – Car rent or finance etc = I Leave you to do the maths.
    If you go LHR From N2 the fare is £34 – £5 com = £29 and if you then take job of the rent you paid him for this job it adds up to about him taking 30 to 40 % of the Fare.

    Embarque – Has only 1 account JP Morgan – I leave to you to decide if it’s worth working for them!!! However Embarque is sister company of Carey Worldwide Chauffeur.

    Uber X LDN (I haven’t worked for them but a friend tells me he makes gross £550 to £700 gross 6x 10hr work – 24.5%inc VAT (20% ex VAT) commission = xyz) the fares are some of the cheapest in London he tells me but he stopped working for them full and now only takes job when is empty to supplement his earning doing a full shift is not worth the times he said as the fares on avg are £1.75p per miles so after commission its £1.32p. they don’t take on MPV’s they only want Merc E Class and Prius. I think you have to be stupid to work for such low rate on a E Class or a Prius.
    A prius cost 23k New and E Class cost 30k+ so in my opinion its not worth joing the new crooks in town. However should the crooks starts charging same as Hailo (12%) and improve the price to about £3 a mile it could be a worth while to do a few jobs with them.

    Hope this feedback helps some of you looking to become a Private Hire Driver. I am soon either going to become a operator or do the knowledge. You cant even make minimum wage in this trade

    1. No cars for UberXHi again Boga. Good luck with whatever you decide on and thanks for the comprehensive rate examples below.

      Clearly, UberX is facing a challenge in getting sufficient drivers to work at the rates offered as you suggest and I predicted above.

      I just had a look as you can see on the left and there are no UberX drivers available at this time.

    2. Do the knowledge, you know it makes sense, you already have a good understanding of London streets, and a minimum of £30.00 an hour on a very bad day. No more money worries and a secure future. On a very good day you can earn your current salary for which your working a whole week for.

      1. Hi Chris,

        I agree with you 100% doing the Knowledge is the best options for a driving career but it is a difficult mind-numbing journey to take. I have a mortgage which has to be paid for and all the other living cost so doing the K is long road full of hurdles and trails. But at the end it pays off if you can get your hands on that badge if not you would waste time. Money and effort (it’s a serious gamble with precious time). If I knew I will lose my career and find it difficult to find a job again I would have started doing the K at age 16 or 18 but now I am in a difficult position. How can I do the knowledge and look after the family at the same time. I don’t see being a PH is a career (I don’t even see it as career) the mosquitoe crooks take up to 40% to 75% of the fare!!! Believe me that’s how much these so called premium/ corporate circuit take of the fare. most small minicab cash circuit eats about 18% to 25%.

        London Executive charge a customer £83 from W1 to LHR (Merc E Class or Galaxy), Do you know how much they pay the driver a miserable £27 some accounts (£25) so in other words your labour is making these boys millionaires while you live on a knife edge. These pompous crooks keep TFL and Boris the buffoon on the straight and narrow so that there are no rights for the drivers. The other party the LTDA and LCDA Black Cab Union are doing as much as possible to treat the PH Drivers as second class as they see it as protecting there trade. At the end of the day we live in capitalist society so such tactics would not work and eventually fail as what matters to the paying business users and general public is quality of service and cost.

        Being a operator is a no brainer really if you have 60 driver paying at least £160 rent + £1 Booking fee or 23% commission you can make upto 3k Net profit after paying all cost, it will give you a gross of 11k+pw week but its also hard work building a business like that.

        Probably a Black Cab makes £1200pw NET (I got this figure from a friend of a friend who just became a black cab driver) he works 50hrs pw. That is a believable figure, I actually think he makes more…. Looking at the figure of Black Cab I am am confident that they make from £4.48 per miles and maybe more depending on traffic. Once when the M4 was closed last year I saw black cab driver smiling with joy as his meter has hit £150 just after the Hammersmith Flyover so I really wonder how much the poor chinise lady at the back actually paid. It took me 3hrs 30min to get to LHR the traffic was hardly moving on the A4.

        1. The knowledge is tough, but that what makes us the very best in the world. If you put your mind to doing the knowledge you will succeed. I have been a plumber for 35 years and decided to do the knowledge, with young children, mortgage, and all the trappings of western society i got my green badge. I don’t have to tell you that being a mini cab driver will always be a struggle. It does not matter to much, how long it takes you to complete the knowledge its a marathon not a sprint. I did not start the knowledge until my mid forties.

          There will always be a huge gulf between mini cabs and London black cabs, but only when you have completed the knowledge will you ever be able to see that divide clearly.

          Oh and just by the way, its possible to earn a 6 figure salary if you put the hours in.

    3. Hi there any advice would be appreciated

      I’m to new to the private hire industry, my pco badge arrived, I need to work. Which ph company is good to join and which I should avoid.


    Saloon GLH Account Moorfields EC2 (Moorgate Station) Manor Rd, TW8 9JN £19.10 £0.00 £19.10
    Saloon GLH Account Newham College, E15 4HT Purdy St, E3 3PD £7.50 £0.00 £7.50
    Saloon GLH Account QMUL Mile End Rd, E1 4NS Carnach Green South, RM15 5PZ £23.30 £0.00 £23.30
    Saloon GLH Account UEL, The Green, Water Lane, E15 Pin Mill, Basildon SS14 1LH £33.90 £0.00 £33.90
    Saloon GLH Account UEL, The Green, Water Lane, E15 Beauchamp Rd, E7 9PD £7.50 £0.00 £7.50
    Saloon GLH CASH 119 Bramble Close, CR0 8JL New Bond St, W1 £32.00 £8.00 £25.60
    Saloon GLH CASH UCLH, Beamount Place, WC1 Hamsted Rd, WC1 £9.00 £2.16 £7.20
    Saloon GLH CASH Camden High St, NW1 N17 £16.50 £3.96 £13.20
    Saloon GLH CASH GLH Base, N2 9PJ Balham High Rd, SW17 7JB £34.00 £6.80 £27.20

  9. What I don’t understand is why these App Start-ups don’t want to take advantage of the gap in the market. They always try to be unique by providing high end cars at knock down prices. Have they realised majority of people just want to get from A 2 B at a reasonable price in safe way. The black cabs are old as 15 years old, the drivers don’t come out suited and booted (they don’t need to). They provide a service of connivance getting people from a to b at the high end of the price in this market. The black cab App has become huge and the reason is the price is the same however a driver only pays 10% commission. On the minicab App Market, the prices are absurd and the commissions are as high as 25% to 40%+. If I had the money I know what market to aim for, I mean why dont these new kids look at the success of hailo. They have now gone worldwide and why because drivers joined as the system was fare. every time something new launches in the minicab market they try to squeeze the driver out of every penny and requires a 20K+ car less then 3-5 years old.

    1. Hi Pulo,

      In my opinion as the private hire and minicab app market matures we will see increased competition in terms of the commission that is charged.

      There is no doubt that consolidation of minicab and taxi apps will occur which will cause commission rates to reduce. The commission charges of Wheely, DRiVR and Uber are too high and if they wish to attract minicab drivers in high numbers to achieve economies of scale then it is a given that commission rates must fall.

      The market that you refer to where an app provides a wider variant in terms of quality is currently serviced by Kabbee and Minicabster who do not work directly with private hire drivers but work solely with private hire operators. The commission they charge private hire operators is likely to be around 10%. However, this is only my best guess.

      Thanks for your views.

  10. Excuse my ignorance, but as a driver many of us are not concern with the other details apart from the cost of the journey to charge our passengers, the maths behind that I for one don’t understand, as not use to it. Lately I’ve started to realise many companies like uber, wheely, all have a minimum fare and a base fare, plus the cost per mileage and cost per minute.

    I being that they don’t use meters how do they know how long a journey will take to charge you and also what is the difference between the minimum fare and base fare and how do they work.

    Many thanks

    1. Uber FareWheely, Uber and DRiVR provide driver apps for their private hire drivers. These use the GPS built in to all smartphones to calculate distance and, in Uber’s case, time as well when the app reports that the minicab driver is travelling at 10 M.P.H. or less.

      An example of a fare when I was a passenger with Uber is on the left. Wheely and DRiVR only charge distance based on the shortest route for the journey rather than relying on the route actually travelled by the minicab driver.

    2. They don’t care how long it takes and Uber only pays for time when moving less then 10mph so at night you would hardly get a penny for time so it is still on avg £1.32p a miles, the figure cab4now stated is Uber Lux NOT Uber X

      1. UberX is not viable for night drivers. But I would loved to have been on that rate earlier today.

        Mayfair to Brentford took 90 minutes starting at 4.15pm. 🙁

        1. Got out of trouble last night with the road works on the great west road, used the chiswick mall, its all about the knowledge. Park lane to kew bridge 24 mins. Hailo went off, Kew road to Muswell hill 32 mins.

  11. This trade are full of poor foreigners who thinks £300pw is amazing. And people like me could not compete with such people and if they paid tax and NI on that £300 net they will be left with making about £3per hr.Tax £880per year + Class 2 NI £150 + 9%NI = £13,370 (WORKING 48WEEKS PER YEAR)

    1. I am finding it hard to differ between those poor foreigners, as you quoted, and the average mini cab driver, aren’t they one of the same. You are moaning about your fellow mini cab driver who has the same writes as you. He or she is paid for there licence and has the same as you.

        1. This article is give any mini cab driver an insight of a average London cab driver who has studied hard to achieve his goal. take a look at his website (VIEW FROM THE MIRROR), It tells his story about doing the knowledge, I think you will find it amusing and educational. This young Londoner obviously has a passion for history like so many London cab drivers, there’s something about the knowledge which draws you in and gets you interested on history of London. It seems the vast majority of London cab drivers have this same passion including myself for London history while doing the knowledge or after receiving there badge. It’s a wonderful feeling when driving people in your cab, and there asking you all sort of questions about historic London sites and your able to inform and educate them on points of interest.
          After receiving your green badge, many cab drivers go on to study there blue badge to become tour guides in and around London, so when you see large groups of people standing around and listening to a individual, he or she is probably a London cabbie giving a guided tour of London. Many thousands of London taxi drivers have given up there own time for various charitable organisations year after year, taking disadvantage or disabled children all around the world. This will I hope explain a little about the London cabbie and it’s long history.

          1. I am aware many of you mini cab drivers regard the knowledge as antiquated, but you would be wrong. When you see a person doing the knowledge riding up and down the road, they are not just memorising the road but the many points of interest. Take for example the Mall, as you enter from the east under Admilralty Arch there are so many points of interest they are absorbing, captain cook statue, ICA galleries, the smallest police station in Britain, Duke of York statue, Nelsons fleet, (Lamp posts), St James palace, Lancaster House, Clarence House, QVA memorial, memorial gates, ect. If it was just leaning the roads it would be a lot easier of coarse. Driving a London cab is not about getting a customer from A to B as quickly as possible, but relaying a little bit of London history to make there journey more interesting. All London cabbies learn these important points. Buckingham Palace being the main point for most visitors, But in fact it was never designed for a palace, but was built as a mansion house for the duke of Buckingham. The mall with its red carpet (tarmac)is only one short road, there’s 25,000 roads to complete, some with far more points of interest they have to study.

    1. Say base fare is £4. Fare goes 1 mile. Mileage rate is £2. Minimum fare is £11. Fare is £6. But minimum fare applies so fare charged is £11 not base plus mileage as minimum is higher.

      1. Since the wide use of the sat Nav, I can’t help but wonder how many deaths and accidents have occurred to date. I myself, not to long ago had a mini cab driver slam into the back of me, I am sure it was because of his reliance of his sat Nav, but that is hard to prove. It took a few days to get used to my Hailo app, to be honest I found it a little distracting, having to take your eyes off the road momentarily. We all know how mini cab drivers throughout the world rely on sat Navs, their eyes must be off the roads for long periods of time. The only exception is the London taxi driver who has studied the knowledge. When using Hailo, once I’ve seen the App go off, I only have to glimpse at the address quickly to know where to go, and that would be the only time my eyes were off the road after picking up and delivering the happy customer to there destination. So for the safety conscious customer I’m sure they would rather sit in a London black cab.

        1. What a load of bollocks, this guy is just playing stupid. Mate some PH knows more then you about London so save the crap.

          You done the knowledge? Well done son!, good on you! Would you like a blue peter badge?

          Gizza you keep going on and ranting about black cab drivers being voted the best etc I think it is a load of crap.

          Who and what voted the black cab drivers the best in the world?
          Who or What source carried out such a survey that covers the entire world or even London for that matter?

          I don’t have problems with black cabs what I have a problem with is there disgusting rotten ugly attitude. On daily basis these ****** drive like dimm-witted dnagerious fools and overtake without any singling then they show hand gestures and swear when one don’t allow such behaviour. They stop whereve and wheneverr they want even thou the law is clear where they can pull over to pick up safely. On a daily basis I see these idiots stopping on junctions and traffic lights to let the punter inn while stopping everyone else.

          I am assuming you and probably most of the black cab drivers love capitalism and almost certainly declare half or less of your earning to her majesty revenue and customs?

          If you love capitalism then stop crying like a bitch the minute you see competition. Every industry/trade has competition in a capitalist system so accept the fact that you have to compete. You got most of your income secure and can’t eat all the cake.

          As for the minicab driver they are just trying to live and being exploited which most drivers know about but are helpless and hopeless. The minicab trade is a swat shop scheme it is the perfect example of tory franchise culture & sweat shop exploitation!

          1. You do rant like a fanatic. I will answer your questions one at a time, so as not to confuse you. You first mentioned that some mini cab drivers no more about London than I do, All 24,000 London black cab drivers know every nook and cranny of London the very first day they get into there taxi after doing the knowledge. Most mini cab drivers like yourself have no or very little experience, so you learn on the job at the customers exspense.
            You failed the test at addison lee, because you said it was hard, you only have to learn the basics to pass.
            Your seconded point was who said London cab drivers are the best in the world, it’s common knowledge throughout the industry, but I will forward you some proof after this note.
            Bad driving by black cab drivers happens of coarse it’s enevatable, but as there are far more mini cabs than black cabs, who do you think are the main culprits.
            Your third point, competition, there is none, London black cabs are unique, apart from the knowledge and all the other fridge benefits associated with being a London cab driver, The iconic London cab purposely designed for occasion. All have wheelchair access, Hearing aid loop, grab bars, various aids for the partially sighted, intercom, privacy screen, safety locks, chair that’s pulls out to the pavement for the disabled, etc.
            It seems to me your are the type of driver incensed by your own failings, looking for trouble and are taking it out on the London cabbie.

    1. So you think hotels.com is a credible/good source do you? if you do good for you. the independent link don’t work. Kind of board with this so I think its best to agree to disagree. Where there is a demand a trade will stay and where there is no demand the trade will go regardless of what that service may be.

      1. bogy fella,
        This is what you said.
        Who and what voted the black cab drivers the best in the world?
        Who or What source carried out such a survey that covers the entire world or even London for that matter?

        Even when you see articles written by dozens of independent companies, voting London black cabs the best in the world. Your blind hatred for London taxi is so obvious. Even when you stare at the truth you fail to register it.

        Do yourself a favour, type in google (London taxis voted best in the world), see dozens of articles proving my point, but I’m sure you have, but just can’t bring yourself to admit your wrong again.

  12. Your black cab drivers prefer black cabs, that’s why they’re riding with you guys, paying rate 3 at night to travel in an uncomfortable cold car listening to an a diatribe on football or immigration. I took a black cab at 3am from Holborn to South Woodford years back, the driver went round the m25, cost a fortune. Fortunately all black cabs have sat navigation these days.

  13. Don’t believe a word you say, you contradict yourself all the time. How the hell does anyone get on the M25 from holborn to South Woodford. Every cab driver nows that route and can name every road and junction to you before leaving holborn. How can the latest £43,000 black leather upholstered, fully air conn, rear independent coil suspension London cab be uncomfortable, it has more leg room than any other vehicle on the market. How can it be cold, all London cabs have independent heat controls for the customer, if your cold maybe you don’t have the intelligence how to work the simple controls. The London cab trade is world famous for topical conversations, many cab drivers after completing their green badge go on to be tour guides of London after completing their blue badge. A London cabbie not to long ago won mastermind, and of coarse i surely don’t have to remind you London cab drivers have larger brains than anybody else because of the knowledge. The customer can sit down in the back of a Taxi in privacy without the smell of body odour emanating from a mini cab driver nervously peering into his Sat Nav hoping the customer is not about to yell at him because he is going the wrong way.

    1. You have never studied the knowledge so i don’t expect you to have clue on what is required and what your left with once you have achieved your green badge. I can tell you that on your very first day out in your London cab and a customer jumps in your cab in or around holborn and ask to take you to Woodford you instantly see your route or other routes immediately.

      How do you become a mini cab driver in London and how do you achieve experience.
      If you have no experience and are learning on the job, then the Sat Nav is the only tool you have and it must be nerve racking having paying customers telling you the driver the quicker way or you are going the wrong way. So after spending a couple of years driving and getting on the job experience in your mini cab, in the past how many customers have you inadvertently upset for being late or not finding their destination quickly enough. these are the stories we here all the time as London cabbies and see with our own eyes daily, with drivers transfixed on there Sat Navs often in the wrong lane, travelling at a snails pace at times looking for their destination, generally driving dangerously Sat Nav style. I’m sure there are plenty of good mini cab drivers working London but that is compounded by many more bad or inexperienced drivers who at times are clueless were they are or were there going.

  14. Every GB i know uses a SatNav of one kind or another.

    Some use a Cabbies Mate as an aide memoir for things they have forgot.

    They are handy for getting you out of trouble in the burbs.

    But i have never used them to get me from A to B. They are handy for taking you in the last few streets though.

    But i have my own way to most places and they are usually different to what the satnav says. They are useless in the West End a bit better in the City.

    Google Maps is good as is the Cabbies Mate, app or proper one.

    But you are correct.

    Any driver relying fully on SatNav is a liability.

    But it is not so common that some punters only want to give you a postcode. Not even an area and certainly not a road name.

  15. The Sat nav is a tool I don’t carry with me. Once you start relying on the sat nav your brain begins to loose the ability to see most of your alternative routes immediately. I was given a sat nav as a present, after a week I left it at home.
    Your brain you trained when doing the knowledge is far superior to the Sat nav and faster believe it or not.
    If a customer jumps in with an address or road I immediately see it, if they give me a post code I don’t see it until I’ve located it on my iPhone. Most of my fellow cabbies carry a Sat nav but rarely use it in every use, but does come in handy on the odd occasion when a rare post code is given. Most people jumping into a London black cab will always give a point of interest or road, occasionally a post code.
    French tourist for example often give post codes as there taxi system is very much like our mini cab system, bearing that in mind it does have the worst reputation in the world for taxi service.

  16. Now that explains why every French passenger has given me a postcode first!

    When they mentioned the St James’s Hotel it was easier to know where to go.

    I am not a fan of As Directed bookings as far as PH goes though.

    That is not the purpose of PH and never will be IMHO

    I would suggest that it is highly likely that the more experienced couriers in London have much better knowledge than a large percentage of PH.

    What do you think of the new MetroCab?

  17. I agree a place of interest is quicker to digest than a post code for most of us with a good sound knowledge of London.
    But people like potato a point of interest would be lost on him.

    I don’t know anything about the new metro, but I hope it doesn’t resemble the look or characteristics of the old one. Customers tell me the metro is the most uncomfortable cab out there followed by the new Vito, for comfort they say the TX4 with its rear independent suspension is far the best out of all London cabs it seems.

    I did like the new TX4 Hydrogen cell that appeared in London well over a year ago but have heard little about it since.
    I prefer Hydrogen technology to electric, what about you ?

  18. Just done a north london to Luton, the got a Luton to East London. Black cab would have had to drive back into town empty. And no use for the k on either of those runs.

    1. What you should be doing is spending time off with the family, but you can’t , you have to work long hours and unsociable hours to pay your rental and other expenses working for someone else. My new cab is paid for, so all profits go directly to me. I probably have to do a third of the hours that you have to achieve every week. I’ll be spending a couple of weeks off for Christmas and new year so as to give you a chance to catch up.
      I did however notice a few days before Christmas after the office parties finished, Addison lee drivers in vast numbers sitting around waiting for long periods for jobs to appear, that would drive me mad and I give up cabbing.
      Speak to your fellow mini cab driver friends who have worked hard and got there badge, they will confirm the rewards for doing the knowledge.
      Regarding your above post, lots of cabbies do not prefer long runs as more money is made staying local. Ideally lots of small jobs. You are right though getting a job back is unlikely. I’ve never ranked up at any airport after dropping off I don’t like waiting, but again, Hailo has changed the way cabbies are now working.
      I live in Enfield, before Hailo I would have to drive into Central London before picking up, now we are picking up so much closer to home, in particular all those 150,000 customers that Addison lost to the black cab Apps.

      1. Chris, 2 years have passed since I wrote Addison Lee – A Driver’s View in 2012. Doesn’t time fly when you’re having fun? In 2012 I worked with Addison Lee as a self employed London minicab driver for only 4 months in the middle of the year.

        The 2012 post relates to my time spent as a self employed London minicab driver in 2011. In 2013 I spent around 6 months with Addison Lee as a self employed London minicab driver. The rest of the time in 2012 and 2013 was spent in Asia and at my home in Malta.

        I agree family time is important. When were you at Addison Lee?

        1. Hi
          You have been very quiet, I thought you were away on your long vacations. You must work very hard at Addison lee to have accrued such long holidays. Is it easy to pick up a car at Addison lee these days, just to work for four or 6 months a year. I’ve never worked as a mini cab driver, certainly not for Addison lee. I would have to be very desperate to become a mini cab driver. I have worked very hard to achieve my goals in life. An electrical heating engineer for around 35 years, in those 35 years I have spent 5 years plastering, 5 years carpentry, and of coarse as you know studied over 4 years studying the knowledge whilst working full time.

          1. Addison Lee will always take good self employed minicab drivers back generally.

            But even I was knocked back once 12 years ago as an owner driver. It was when there were both owner drivers and company car drivers.

            Fortunately, Malcolm is no longer at Addison Lee and Tony who wanted me back then now has the final say and he has a better sense of humour.

            I was a little lively in those days. 🙂

            If you don’t get a free week based on your points each quarter you would be much better off driving a bus. Any holiday weeks that you don’t use are still waiting for you on your return. Even after a long break.

            I’m home in Malta for another two weeks Chris.

    2. You keep opening your mouth and continue to show your ignorance. The knowledge extends to 12 miles of London, not just around the centre. We know all those little short cuts and places of interests around the whole of the Londons suburbs. You have to saturate all of the twelve miles of London, which you seem to forget or are ignorant of. When you completed the knowledge you then go on to do your suburbs.

  19. Hydrogen fuel cells are a good idea if they can make it robust

    You can google the new Metrocab, the company involved is called Fraser Nash.

    It is characterful, and has more than a hint of air de taxi.

    More in keeping than a Vito, which now have supersides on them so look even more like a deliver van.

    Apparently the generator/engine is fitted in such a way that it can be replaced by a hydrogen fuel cell in future

    This new Metrocab really will silence critics of Taxis as far as pollution and noise goes.

    I honk you are missing the point slightly Potato.

    Rate 3 is in the £5 a mile mark and also time is charged when below a certain speed

    A GB wouldn’t need to bring something back in as the first Luton would have paid north of £200 on its own

    And if they were on Comcab and they were miles away but the only free cab they would clock up running in miles.

    Think of a cab as a nice little shop, except you can move it about to sit where the punters are

    You can make decent money if things fall right in PH

    But look at the case in point with Uber

    They flooded the circuit and introduced competing services within the company

    I think they were hoping to in erase demand by improving availability

    Which shows a lack of understanding of the way PH works in London

    Which is why GB numbers are fairly strictly controlled

    To ensure it is still a good way to make a living

    I remember a job I was given when I worked AL during the Olympics, just tried it to see what was what, left my hose in Purfleet and got pinged for a job in Tilbury.

    Drove out there and it was going to a Hospital in Dartford

    Job paid less than £14 and I never got reek ruses for the Dartford Toll

    AL made more from that job than I did

    That price is an insult, may have been better for cash I suppose.

    Use AL for what you need.

    But in the quiet period between 3am and 4:30am consider doing a couple of runs a night

    1. The limitation of the numbers of London cabbies has in the past been the knowledge itself, 30 years ago doing the knowledge was relatively easier to complete. These days with a failure rate of around 60% of pupils doing the knowledge numbers are kept down. It seems they just keep increasing the points to keep it hard and then possibly ease of a little to make up numbers.

  20. I think my longest wait has been over 2 hours on Heathrow rank. In busy times the next job is assigned a few minutes before we drop. Might be quiet times ahead but marketing, new app and new staff in head office should keep us busy, taking more work from overpriced black cabs. I don’t know why anyone other than tourists, drunks and Saatchi use them any more. They’re a bit like red telephone boxes.

    1. I have noticed you keep making remarks on the price of a black cab compared to Addison lee, I am however aware you are recently new to Addison lee, so here is some information for you to digest. Hailo is cheaper to most airports than Addison lee, most short jobs in a black cab is cheaper than Addison lee, The way Addison lee prices are zone to zone it can and does work out cheaper In a London cab. In a black cab for example a trip shall we say from Covent garden to Waterloo station is around £9.00 the minimum charge is approx £12 min with Addison lee and that’s for cash £16.00 for account customers. Hailo new minimum charge would be £10.00 for cash and the same for account customers, that’s why Addison lee are losing customers in there thousands and it’s about to get a lot worse.

      I am aware you think I’m a know it all, but you keep making stupid ignorant statements, and I love winding you up.

      What would you think a Hailo cab would charge from Kensington to Heathrow?

  21. New Metrocab does look interesting doesn’t it Chris.

    Not to different from a TX4 to be confused with a minicab like the Vito or NV200.

    I think Potato is still in the honeymoon period at AddLee.

    Likely still an Oscar driver so getting more cash work than he ever will again.

    Cab4Now has, like most who make reasonable money, found his own way to make AddLee pay.

    But mile for mile the profits are slim pickings.

    They are slim pickings everywhere in PH to be honest.

    Very quiet at the moment which is not a good thing for PH as you have no way of chasing work.

    Just have to sit and wait.

    Last night i was out at 21:00 first job at 22:40 from Brook Mees to StMartins Hotel. £16

    Next one was Mortons to Parker St by Drury Lane at 02:10. £15

    Was looking to be a real s**t night till i got a job to pick up from Dover St.

    Fortunately it went to Old Woking, nice private estate.

    That saved the night £134. As one bloke had to chat to ralph on his way there, enough notice to pull over, the person that booked it gave me a £40 tip.

    But if anybody is saying they are doing well at the moment then they don’t know what good is.

    And they perhaps haven’t missed their docket target two weeks on the trot and end up owing AL money after they have taken all your account earnings.

    Uber, not UberX, though, was till recently one of the few places a PH driver could make decent money without spending 12 hours at work over 6 or 7 days.

    I have made £380 before commission in a 10hr Thursday. Minus 20% and it looks less substantial. As you really only crack £300.

    In the new year i will likely still do some for Uber. But will go back to one of the large account firms. Perhaps Excel or London Exec.


    Because i am going VAT registered in January so £200 a day becomes £240.

    Then a few hours on Thu and Sat to top up.

    Target will be £1500 a week.

    Not saying i will make it every week.

    But i have a plan.

    Work hard. Get ahead. Start doing the BB again. The new iPad apps seem a good idea from Wizaan.

    I hope potato listens to what is said here.

    As it would be a shame if he was to get stuck at AddLee for years

    I also wonder how much of a drop the rate reduction in January will be. I don’t think any of it should be passed on to the driver as the Co can balance it out with economies of scale. A driver can’t as only one punter fits in the back at one time.

    Is it any wonder that drivers double shift their vehicles with a friend or family member.

    One runs out of the minicab office on Battersea Park Rd and several run from minicab offices in Hackney.

    Others just run the vehicle for two shifts at AddLee

    1. I like the look of the new metro cab, it has a more traditional shape to the New TX4 I drive, according to customers the old shape metro was very uncomfortable and does look like a fish out of water. I very much hope LTA develop a hydrogen cab for the market soon, saw the hydrogen TX4, driving down park lane a couple of years ago and have not seen or heard much about it since.

      Potato doesn’t see past his nose, regarding global sales of Taxis.

      I had a choice of going shopping with my wife yesterday or jumping in the cab to escape, yep went out in the cab, I was expecting it to be quite, but to my surprise is was very busy indeed. Got a Hailo job from Southgate to Sloane ave, good start and it just got better as the day progressed, not many big jobs just continuous small to medium jobs. Every station I dropped passengers off, had long queues of passengers and hardly any taxis.

      The nice thing about being a cabbie and choosing the days and hours you work is there is no downtime, the work is continuos and all the financial proceeds are mine.
      I choose to work the busy days and I don’t stop, and that’s no exaggeration.
      Last night wasn’t exceptionally busy, but it did not go without a customer in my cab for more than around 6 minutes at any given time.

      This one is for potato. If you see very long queues at shall we say, Paddington Station, going all the way round to Harrow road was does that indicate to you?

  22. Oh, one further thing Potato.

    Cab4now will back me up on this.

    But London PH drivers were making £150-200 a shift back in ’96. Some drivers were on £750 a week guarantee for 5 12 hour shifts. With diesel a fraction of what it was today..

    With ever more immigrant labour and poorly skilled british labour entering the trade i am afraid the earnings and mileage rates are only going to go one way.

    And the numbers of GB are indeed limited as Chris says. You get you badge when they decide you get your badge.

    Look at the scores on the Wizaan site for proof.

    Steady C and D boys suddenly get an A and are out for Christmas. Other solid A and B blokes suddenly get a D and don’t get out till Jan

    There is a set number of badges given out a week and it has been the same for years.

    Licencing of PH was originally a noble thing to make travel safer. But since then it has became very similar to council run parking. Nothing more than a local authority cash cow.

  23. I do fine with ad lee, first job today was en5 to Gatwick, quiet down here though, might head into town. Should be a good day. I do 1 bb run a day. How can metrocab succeed, the sales volume will be so low vs 3 competitors, and Nissan will probably get a hybrid out somewhere down the road. All 4 can’t make money is such a tiny market. Ltc barely going as it is, assembling Chinese kits. Yesterday very quiet, kippers for dinner.

    1. Potato
      I don’t quite understand how you can continue to make ignorant remarks to the London black cabs, and do the knowledge it doesn’t make sense. I’m a good judge of character normally, and I don’t believe you have what it takes to complete the knowledge. One thing I’m certain of though as you progress through the process of doing the knowledge and finish your points, you will Certainly have a completely different outlook on the London cabbie and the knowledge.

      You never got back on my question on Heathrow pricing.

  24. Potato

    You need to realise that some people posting on here have worked for AddLee and have mates that still do.

    I wouldn’t count on getting an EN to Gatwick more than once in a while.

    And when you stop being an Oscar driver and your free weeks run out and you have done lots of big ticket jobs you realise that minimums are needed to get your point target.

    No point earning £1000 only to have to pay full rent, full circuit fee as well as car wash and insurance.

    Lets face it if AddLee was so good you wouldn’t be doing a BB run every day.

    At that rate it will take you over a year just to do the runs once. Without touching points or reverses.

    You need to be doing more. 3 runs a day at least and calling them over.

    £1000-£500 (ish) for rent and circuit – £150 diesel = £350.

    £700 – £0 (free car and circuit) – £120 diesel = £580

    That is the reason you need to avoid dead miles.

    Cab4Now comes in past Gatwick every day. He doesn’t drive out there.

    You have a simplistic view on how to make money in PH.

    My GB mate typically outs 35k miles on his TX4 each year but drives in from Rochester every day.

    He makes a minimum of £1000 over his 5 evenings. His target is a minimum of £200 a day. He works usually much less than 8 hours and has a 1 hr sit down lunch at 9pm till 10pm.

    His son works Heathrow fairly often. He might sit on the feeder for an hour or so but he watches dvd’s or similar then usually grabs a £90/100 job into town.

    Then dinner and light on for rate 3 madness at £5 a mile.

    Only two of the cab drivers i know haven’t worked for AddLee and they have been GB for 15 and 25 yrs respectively.

    All the others worked AL in the opencall days as did Cab4Now.

    That was when an AL driver could make serious money. Those days are now gone for good.

    AL proved beyond a doubt that in PH quantity is better than quality.

    1. London PH drivers were making £150-200 a shift back in ’96.

      Confirmed. 12 hours would see you at the higher end. I used to do Monday to Thursday and rarely cleared less than a bag. After expenses.

    1. It’s difficult to say online the revenue potential of what a black cabbie can make in a day. Some are happy with a couple of hundred some work for £500 a day. It depends on how you you work your week. Speaking to a cabbie the other day he works tirelessly for £2,500 per week, that’s not uncommon believe me. The work is out there if you want it. We all work hard the first view years to make money, but as the years creep in, you adjust to keep you sane.

      1. Yeah, no doubt. I was referring to the PH calculations, they bear no relation to the earnings of a hard working AL driver. Another good day at AL today.

        1. Who are you kidding, amazing how every day is a good day for you, working for Addison lee, your previous earnings with your last operator must have been really bad if you are happy with what you are earning know.
          Most people on this site know the finical potential for working for Addison lee.

        2. You are still an Oscar driver aren’t you.

          If you are unaware where those figures are from then you have never had to pay for your vehicle and circuit fee.

          You had to study to pass the knowledge test at AddLee!

          I hsve been in the PH and courier gsme on and off for 20 odd years.

          Back when AL was the pinnacle of a PH drivers career. All opencall. The other big earning circuit was Meadway.

          You are pretty arrogant for somebody in the game ten minutes.

          Either that or you are a fantasist.

          But just for clarity.

          An UberLUX driver could easily make £500 in a 12hr shift till Dec. Dead as a doornail at the moment, but It will pick up again in 2nd week of Jan.

          And if the number of AL parked up in Berkeley Sq is anything to go by then very few if any AL drivers are making big bucks at the moment.

          Certainly my contacts there have said it is fairly slow.

          Unless you join the ranks at LGW or LHR. You might have to wait but you will get a job. You could try STN but even thoigh most jobs are £70-100 you run the risk of sitting for 4 hours to get it and only score a couple of points. Then that big job suddenly costs you money when you miss your points target.

          Sadly you typify the deluded drivers that bulk up the fleet at AddLee

          With no idea how much money you are actually taking.

          As i said Uber is dead at the moment but tickig along steadily.

          Managed to coax the earnigs to £200 last night. Lots of minimums though.

          So actually only did 60 miles including driving in and out.

          But i have a little test for you Potato

          I had a job on Friday night.

          10pm so traffic terrible

          Pick up Avery Row. Going to St Martins Hotel.

          I will post up my route. Took me 10 minutes.

        1. Well maybe you are the only mini cab driver in London that is being totally honest with the tax man and declaring his true income. In past posts you have spoken and stated you have many friends who are cabbies, I’m sure that they will confirm to you their possible earnings. I doubt you have any cabbie friends or friends at all because of the ignorant comments you keep making.

          I am still waiting for your answer about kensington to heathrow.

  25. It’s difficult to say online the revenue potential of what a black cabbie can make in a day. Some are happy with a couple of hundred some work for £500 a day. It depends on how you you work your week. Speaking to a cabbie the other day he works tirelessly for £2,500 per week, that’s not uncommon believe me. The work is out there if you want it. We all work hard the first view years to make money, but as the years creep in, you adjust to keep you sane.

  26. O be honest Chris

    I don’t think Potato has listenee one bit.

    Likely so green he is still not allowed in half the bluechip accouts in the City.

    Wonder if he even knows where Deutche Bank even is.

    I have seen people like that before.

    Concentrating on the top line rsther thsn the bottom line.

    If he is unable to see that my figures related directly to AL earnings then i don’t know what to say.

    I have spoken to drivers that have done 60 hours and have to hang out for points otherwise they owe AL money as they have not done enough account work to cover costs and their cash earnings hsve gone into the tank and either MacDs or Ferraris.

    Or perhaps over to see Pete at Finsbury Sq.

    With the rate drops for AL drivers coming in the New Year then getting stuck into the KoL is even more important.

    1. Potato just likes to make ripples, your right though keen and green.

      I think for the private hire interesting times are here, I do however see Uber becoming more popular in the future, but sadly I believe it will be at mostly Addison lee’s expense.

      Get stuck in and finish the knowledge, don’t know what stage your at, but my advice for what its worth is do the runs, then only do the points that the pco are calling.

        1. My mate Col did the extra studying to qualify as a tour guide.

          Wears a little badge to signify the fact on the strap of his GB

          Took him several months of hard studying to get it.

          Do you think Potato will answer my route question that i posed above?

          Avery Row to St Martins Hotel

          Was actually good for me that traffic was heavy as i had to think for a second to avoid most of it.

          Think i kept pretty close to the line.

          1. Hopefully when you make a quick judgement call to go a certain route and it turns out well, the customers are always impressed, although occasionally you will hit traffic, its like rolling dice at times.

            Über will take some work away from cabbies as well thats for sure, but I would say the work Hailo has won and continues to win and expand I’m not overly worried. I have heard, although from second hand information, that Hailo”s next round of investment is very substantial £80 million.

            I know a few places where Addison lee drivers openly tout. I have never seen touting to the level it is at the moment its well out of control, exspecialy the clip board johnnies.
            It so easy to catch touts, so i wish TFL did more.

            Pedicabs, what can I say, politicians talk and years go by, one step forward, two steps backwards.

            Did you look up ( view from the mirror ) site?

        2. I think you are spot on with the comment about Uber

          UberX is taking a chunk of work from AL at the expense of the brand image being hammered by thr influx of less able drivers

          More often we say commentd regarding lack of knowledge and it is an UberX driver involved

          Many of the UberExec drivers seem to be on hourly rate at DRiVR or work the clubs and casinos.

          UberLUX has similar punters to Cabs.

          But they are as likely to take a Cab as an Uber and are more interested in getting transport now.

          Though i suspect they have taken work from Hailo or GetTaxi rather than street hails

          Londoners still amaze me in what they do to get home.

          Touts are out in force after 3am most nights. Seen a bloke in a black/bkue old S Class (something like an 01 model) in Berkeley Sq touting outside Mortons. Luckily a cab with light on chased him off in time.

          He was too quick for me to get his reg but his time will come.

          Will admit i haven’t seen any AL touting lately. But i tend to avoid Shaftesbury Ave unless i have to so maybe they are doing it there.

          Seems that there are poxy pedicabs everywhere. Coventry St is all messed up. Great Windmill St is a joke. Theyneed to be banned and banned now.

  27. Have found that site Chris

    Am going to have a proper read of it over the next few days.

    As Potato didn’t answer my question i shall post up my route from Avery Row to St Martins Hotel for a giggle.

    Lve by Brooks Mews

    Rt Davies St

    Rt Brook St

    Rt New Bond St

    Fwd New Clifford St

    Rt Saville Row

    Lt Vigo St (now open again thank god)

    Rt Regents St

    Fwd Picadilly Circus

    Fwd Coventry St

    Rt Whitcomb St

    Lt Orange St

    Lt+Rt Charing Cross Road

    Lt William IV St

    Lt Chandos Pl

    Lt Bedford St

    Lt New Row

    Lt St Martins Lane


    I don’t go up Bedfordbury as not sure if my LWB XJ will make the turn at the top into New Row.

    I suspect Potatos SatNav on his AddLee PDA would take him round Grosvenor Sq, Berkeley Sq round Trafalgar Sq up Duncannon onto the Strand then up Bedford St. Or perhaps all the way up Charing Cross Rd in the traffic. To get to St Martins Lane.

    1. Good route, that would be a route I would use depending of coarse on the time of the day or night. If the traffic is a little heavy I sometimes use Hanover square leave by st George st, left conduit st, right Saville row, left new Burlington St, right Regent st, left glasshouse st, right Sherwood st, forward great windmill st, forward Haymarket, left orange st. Both are good cuts.
      If traffic is gridlocked I would possible go a similar route coming out at Burlington gardens left old bond st, left Piccadilly, right duke st st James.
      As you know it’s having a choice you see in your head immediately a customer jumps in, and every London cab driver would know these routes without hesitation the very first day they pick up there cab.
      I say this with no disrespect to you as you have a wealth of exsperiance working London, but there are many mini cab drivers with little or no exsperiance and they are the ones giving mini cab drivers a bad reputation.

    2. Hi Guys, I’m a GB holder. As far as the route goes, if there’s build up else where, another viable way would be;

      Leave by Davis St
      R Brook St
      R St George St
      L Conduit St
      L Grt Marleborough St
      F Noel St
      R Berwick St
      R Broadwick St
      L Lexington St
      R Beak St
      L Upper James St
      F Golden Square
      F Lower James St
      F Sherwood St
      B/L Denman St
      F Grt Windmill St
      L Coventry St
      L Whitcombe St
      L Orange St
      R Charing Cross Rd
      L William IV St
      L Chandos Place
      L Bedfordbury
      L New Row
      L St Martins Lane


      Be lucky lads. Keep up the good work!

  28. True.

    I did do most of BB1 after i retired but the injuries that caused my retirement also made riding the scooter somewhat painful so i stopped.

    I gave AL a shot during the Olympics with the thought to do a few runs in the quiet periods but that was a non starter as they were so quiet at the time i had to chase work to get points.

    I had fully intended to do the KoL after retirement as a lot of ex emergency services staff do, i even had my own TX4 bought. A nice 1 owner Charcoal Grey Silver spec on an 07 which i rented out.

    My pension and rental income ended up subsidising AL earnings.

    When AL is quiet the drivers are in trouble, simple as that, which explains why Cab4Now bails out to warmer climes that time of year. No point flogging a dead horse.

    I had never considered your route. But will give it a go next time i go that way.

    The reason i use the Orange St cut through is due to doing PH for Capital Radio back in the late 90’s so we used to use it a lot.

    Pity that they have hacked London about so much since then.

    I had a read of that blokes blog. Seems he did a lot of it at night in a car.

    For some reason i find it harder to learn the streets at night! Go figure.

    If you are out tonight, be lucky.

    1. I know what you mean about being on the bike for so long, it does take it out on the body, even for the younger guys and girls. You are never to old to do the knowledge. If I was to do the knowledge all over again,
      I would do the runs without doing the points, get them over and done as quickly as possible, call the runs as often as you can, and only chase the points that have been called at the PCO, don’t waste time chasing points than haven’t been called.
      I like a fool was one of the first to do the new 320 runs, years ago, Dean at wizAnn was not sure how or what points were going to be called at the PCO on the new system, so he produced this book with thousands of points that had been used at the carriage office for years, take for example the first run Manor house, apart from all the normal points i studied around 6 hotels on the seven sisters road, none of those hotels were ever asked by the examiners in all the time i did the knowledge a complete waste of my time.
      I enjoyed studying the knowledge for the first three years on a bike, you see more, you have a better vision, and you can nip up and down roads and alleys, the slower you go the more you see.
      In your case it is not impossible to do it in a car, might take a little longer, but the home studies is the most important, point to point.

      Im sure all mini cab drivers did well last night, always the best night of the year.
      Around midnight, to about 6am I did mainly Hailo jobs all night, it just seems to be easier, if they are sober enough to use the Hailo app, there sober enough to get in my cab.

  29. Yeah.
    Wizaan is the system that seems to be the best one.

    If you check the Wizaan site you will see my mates son.

    No1 on the Roll of Honour.

    He used to be a point collector forWizaan and he used the targeted approach that you mention.

    Going to have to do some serious thinking in the NY.

    Not huge money made on Uber unless you landed on a roader.

    Made £390 before commission. Surge prices only on for at most 2 hours then quickly back to normal rates.

    Made more working NY with ACS from Fabric, Pasha(SW1) and The End back in the 90’s to be honest.

    Suspect Touts and AL made more than many.

    Hailo seems to be a good option. Especially with no worries about getting paid.

    Did have one job on surge that made me laugh.

    Wanted picked up on Piccadilly so met them on Brick St. Wanted to go to Trebeck St. Paid £35. Pity it took me 10 minutes to get them in the car!

    Still don’t knkw why they bothered. They could have walked it in 2 minutes.

    1. Can’t believe the amount of petty quibbling that goes on here !

      Each to their own as far as I’m concerned as I mentioned elsewhere I’m on the KoL have been for a while but in the near future will I hope be working for Addison Lee, as they provide complete flexibility plus an opportunity to earn some money whilst I gain yet more familiarity and experience driving around London.

      I’m told by a number of Addison Lee drivers on the KoL that the best way is a very early start sign off about 10.30. Revision and map work until about 2.30 then work for a few hours.

      It will be tough but hopefully fruitful, I would add is to not underestimate the enormity of the KoL and enjoy the early stages of BB and points as it gets much much tougher in terms of revision and p2p work the further in you go.

      1. Not a good opening line.
        Some interesting post given with room for thought.
        Occasionally you have individuals who generalise against the London black cab industry with slurs and half truths, and as a very proud London cabbie, I like to point out more facts than fiction.

        More cabbies come from organisations like the Police, post office, fire brigade than the mini cab trade.

        There is no similarities between the mini cab trade and the London taxi trade, two completely different trades, some people think because we transport the general public we are similar or doing the same job.
        If you believe that point of view then a bus driver, train driver, pedi cab driver, chauffeur, ect, are all the same.

        Your choice to work for Addison lee to pay your way to doing the knowledge, but your end goal is to become a London black cab driver, recognised around the world as the best.

        London black cabs is a career choice and not made lightly.

        The very first day you pick up your first customer, you will have the green badge around your neck and you will be very proud of what you have achieved, and that will live with you through your career. The general public will also know what you have achieved every time they step into your taxi, for they to know what it takes to become a London cabbie.

        1. Chris, Good opening line or not doesn’t detract from what I’ve read.

          I fully accept that you are rightly proud of your achievements but feel that it is not right to denigrate other occupations whether it be minicab drivers, bus drivers or train drivers. They all have a role to play and remember an occupation/wage does not define a person it’s what they do in life.

          If money was the goal for me I would have remained in my old well paid,(company car/good bonuses) position at a multi-national but it is not what I crave. What you worked hard for and now have is the freedom to choose your work hours, holidays and answer only to yourself/family.

          You just can’t put a value on that and for me that is what it’s all about.

          1. I wasn’t belittling anybody in there life choices, that was your mistaken interpretation. Just pointing out the difference in trades.
            I also think you jumped the gun a little on your second paragraph. It’s no business of mine what your past or present circumstances led you decide your future.
            I applaud you for taking up a new challenge to become a London cabbie.
            When the day comes and you achieve getting your green badge, and you read an article that is factually wrong, you would verbally defend yourself.

    2. I was told by an individual that Uber did not do surge charges in London, obviously not true then.
      How does the surge charge work and what are there prices?

      As you know we can only charge £4 extra on New Year’s Eve after 8 pm on rate 3.
      Out of interest what do other mini cab companies charge extra?

      1. They do indeed surge in London Chris.

        But it is very rare.

        No surge that i saw on Xmas eve, xmas day or boxing day.

        Surge lasted till just after 02:00 on NY and then it was back to normal rates.

        Unless you were lucky nobody made big money at Uber over the festive season.

        How many UberLUX drivers will stick it out till work improves i don’t know.

        Big running costs mean a few quiet weeks put your HP at risk and not being able to upgrade with fresh HP in future could kill a fledgling chauffeur stone dead.

        Most if not all UberX work for other minicab circuits.

        Parking up the Jag is on my list of possible future moves.

        Not going to ruin my financial future for anybody.

        UberLUX rates are ok. But after commission not outstanding.

          1. You got my interest up again about hydrogen technology.
            It seems such a simple process to produce, compared to other technologies.
            The hydrogen TX4 I saw a couple of years ago seems to have stalled, maybe because of the sale to the Chinese firm Geely.
            Passing a current through water that produces hydrogen and then storing the current into fuel cells for me is the way forward, it seems platinum is a rare and costly mineral for this use, but various organisations are producing alternatives to keep cost down, interesting future.
            Free road tax for the hydrogen taxi. Did you know the TX4 road tax is just shy of £500 a year.

        1. Hailo is reducing the minimum to £8, thats good news for day cabbies.
          Kipper season is here, went out Saturday and took reasonable money.
          Addison lee I think are going to suffer, a lot of hope is being put on the new app review and changes, but with all the new apps out, it will stunt any growth predicted. It seems although PH drivers are complaining about the new apps out, they are doing rather well, slowly but surely.
          I have never seen so many Addison lee cars parked up waiting for work, it must be so frustrating.
          I still at times find it so strange that cabbies are not on Hailo, it is the best thing to happen to the cab trade.

          1. I was out from just after 8pm till 3am on Friday and took £34 before commission.

            Luckily a mate had a booking taking a bride and groom home from a reception in SE10 to Marrytt Sq(spelling!) Off Munster Rd.

            Paid £72

            Then was on Uber from just after 10pm till 3am. Made another £90/100 before commission.

            Lots of sitting around then two jobs linked up a bit.

            Did nothing from before 2am ao called it a day at 3.

            I think the UberX drivers are doing ok.

            And i also noticed the numbers of AddLee drivers.Sitting about waiting for work.

            I am going to see London Exec and Excel this week, maybe Brunel or Cabot next week.

            To see what is on offer at the big account firms.

            Then start planning my next move.

            Would be easier if i didn’t have over £30k of strap to pay back!

            Will still stay signed up to Uber. But only use it when it works for me to do so.

            A lot of their customers are really nice people. But then you get the punters were one friend is a drunken pain in**** and if you get a puker it ain’t easy to get it cleaned properly.

            And to get anything back from the customer/Uber you have to give them a VAT receipt apparently.

  30. It might seem strange but I find it much easier doing p2p than just trying to go from one street to the with just the street as a destination

    Though I still struggle to remember roadnames at times

    1. Yep I agree, it’s easier to have a point for reference than a street. If some one jumped into your cab and asked for Piccadilly, the next question you are going to ask them is where about in Piccadilly.

      Remembering road names is tough, but constant point to point will in time those roads will roll off your tongue and stick.

      Knowing where the points are exactly is so important to a cabbie, if a customer jumps in to your cab and asked for place of interest like Gavin’s in Baker Street and you are east or west of that point, knowing exactly where it is is so important, get it wrong on an appearance and it could cost you points, get it right when a customer asked for it, you save them time and money and the admiration of a happy and impressed customer.

    2. Agreed as long as you’re comfortable with the point in question i.e. you know your next L/R whether a spin is required etc

      P2P can be fun or it can be painful, it goes from the simple slight blue book variants to short but intricate T/A required SDOL only or monster lines like Harlesden to Catford.

      I currently call BB,MP’s,T/As,Bankers, Points,as well as an ever growing number of my own lines. That aside 2-3 hours minimum p2p and out on the bike regularly. As I mentioned earlier the enormity of the KoL is not to be underestimated.

      1. If you don’t no the point you can’t do the run.
        When you are further down the line on the knowledge, say on your 21s, the blue book runs have little or no part to play.
        By then you have to be good, precise, with little hesitation.
        I spent nearly five years studying the knowledge, whilst working full time, a friend of mine who gave up a 6 figure salary job in the city, who spent full time studying the knowledge completed it under 2 years 7 months .
        My friends advice on how to complete the knowledge would be more compelling than mine.

  31. Thanks for an interesting reading!!! Your initial post on Wheely, DRiVR and Uber commission rate was almost a year ago now. Do you know if they have now reduced their rate?

  32. Hi there any advice would be appreciated

    I’m to new to the private hire industry, my pco badge arrived, I need to work. Which ph company is good to join and which I should avoid.


  33. Ho Danji,

    If you want a company car then Addison Lee is your best choice.

    If you want to be an owner driver then working Hailo and Uber together is the best option.

    Good luck mate.

  34. Danji if you fail the AL test then you are likely not up to driving round London for work.

    You either have to work on a van or motorbike to learn the streets.

    Or get hold of the first set of 80 runs from a knowledge school like Wizaan and drive the runs.

    The first 80 will get you round a large part of London.

    If you need to rely on SatNav you will not be able to provide a decent level of service.

    Would you like a Minicab driver that can’t find where he is going properly?

    The Addison Lee system is designed for a driver who isn’t particularly experienced to earn.

    Just don’t expect to be earning the kind of money Cab4Now has done when at AddLee.

  35. Thank you very much Justin for your very honest answer. There are companies you can work that welcomes new drivers but really bad pay. I reply on a tom tom sat, with traffic avoidances but it’s still difficult as customers expect you not get stuck in traffic.

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